Sorry, the comment form is closed at this time.

• Churchmouse April 5, 2005 3:24 pm

  

  Regarding the broadcast archives, I’d love to hear some of those discussions; but unfortunately I am limited to a 28K dialup connection and so it is not practically feasible for me to download those files. 🙁 At best I can only pull up the corresponding blogs and infer what was discussed by the posted comments.

• Churchmouse April 5, 2005 3:17 pm

  

  >People who consider themselves “Christian,” on a regular basis, murder and assault people just because they’re gay. The assaults literally occur every day…
  I’m not aware of assaults occurring this frequently; but for the sake of discussion, I’ll grant the premise. Still, as Vicky points out, someone professing “Christianity” (or religion) doesn’t mean that they are in fact a genuine follower of that faith. A true Christian would not harm, oppress or kill anyone in the name of Jesus. I understand that the barbaric animals–er, young men who attacked and killed Matthew Shepard belonged to the racist, so-called “Christian Identity” movement (with beliefs/objectives similar to the KKK). I could be mistaken about that, although they certainly weren’t Christians in any sense of the word.
  Mark, you imply that Dr. Dobson has made false and intentionally misleading statements about Christians being fired and etc. on his website…Could you post some of the links for those, so we can check them out in context?
  To answer your earlier question, no, I don’t know offhand of any Christians who have been actually murdered by homosexuals or anyone acting on behalf of the homosexual community. But I am aware that Christians have been verbally villified (sp), cursed, spat on, denied equal access to First Amendment rights (i.e., during public demonstrations), while their religious services were disrupted and property defaced/destroyed (as Vicky mentioned earlier), all because of their spiritual beliefs regarding the homosexual/lesbian lifestyle; and (in some cases) merely venturing to assert that there is another way, a way of hope and healing available for those experiencing it’s destructive effects.
  Where has Dr. Dobson — or any conservative Christian leader or parachurch organization (Dr. James Kennedy, Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, Josh McDowell, Gary Bauer, etc.) advocated violence or hatred towards homosexuals? (and I’m not referring to their opposition to homosexual marriage or adoption as a valid example of “hatred”). To the contrary, they’ve made many public statements denouncing such actions and individuals such as those who physically attacked and killed Matthew Shepard. Just for the record, I myself do not condone violence or vandalism in any form. Two wrongs never make a right.

• Vicky April 5, 2005 1:52 pm

  

  Mark, Just because someone identifies themselves as “Christian” doesn’t make it so – “by their works, we shall know them.” A TRUE Christian (a believer and follower of Jesus Christ,) while not perfect, would NOT do something like this.
  The term “Christian” is used very freely and loosely from what true believers know the Bible teaches.

• Mark Levine April 5, 2005 10:43 am

  

  To be clear, I do not support vandalism of any kind. There are good gay people and bad gay people. There are good Christians and bad Christians. Here’s the difference:
  People who consider themselves “Christian,” on a regular basis, murder and assault people just because they’re gay. The assaults literally occur every day.
  I’m not aware of a single person who considers himself gay who has killed or assaulted anyone just because he/she is Christian. Are you? A single assault?
  (I don’t have time to read about Jesse now, but rest assured, I will. Is there any evidence Jesse was killed BECAUSE he was Christian? I support hate crimes legislation with greater punishment for anyone who kills or assaults someone because of the victim’s religion, race, or sexual orientation.)

• Vicky April 5, 2005 8:14 am

  

  Mark,
  In your post above, you make mention that Dobson says “gay people aren’t brought into caskets by Christians.” That isn’t what Dobson said – in this particular response of his, he was referring specifically to his office and the ministry of Focus on the Family in Colorado Springs. They have had caskets delivered to their front door, bricks thrown through their windows, bloody animal parts left on the property, their buildings have been spray painted and bomb threats made against them at their offices. Dobson and Focus on the Family ministries have not retaliated.
  You mentioned Matthew Shepherd, whose story received much media attention; how many are aware of 13 year old Jesse Dirkhising who was killed by two gay men in September of 1999 – (Dirkhising suffocated to death during the early morning hours of Sept. 26, 1999, after being bound, drugged, gagged and brutally sodomized by Davis Don Carpenter, then 38, and Joshua Macabe Brown, then 22, at the men’s apartment in Rogers, Ark.)
  The news account is graphic and not at all pretty.
  http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=29026
  http://www.family.org/cforum/citizenmag/features/a0009916.cfm
  It’s no more fair for you or anyone to accuse “Christians” of hate crimes against gays, than it is for someone to say that homosexuals would do what Carpenter and Brown did to young Jesse Dirkhising.